• Ffxiv Patch 4.3
• Wow Patch 4.3

Hello, everyone. This is FFXIV Producer and Director, Naoki Yoshida. Patch 4.1 saw the introduction of the residential area, Shirogane, and though we are pleased to see so many players enjoying this area, we also received a great deal of feedback regarding this newest addition to housing. While a great number of you were interested in either purchasing or relocating to a plot in Shirogane, we.

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Live Content. Current Patch: Latest Hotfix: Arrived Maintenance. Topics. Notices. Subreddit Legend: Posting Rules: Please read our before posting. Lately I've been seeing more 'authentic' (real players) using bots. At Urth's spiritbonding, it's not unusual to see someone botting to spiritbond their gear.

It's kind of obvious because they sometimes get stuck or they move really oddly. They also don't respond. It's odd for me because I spend hours crafting and hours spiritbonding.

Yet these people can just load up a bot over night and get all their gear bonded. It also impacts the economy because I have to compete with prices.

If they don't bot, the prices end up being higher due to less supply. It sucks because I also see FC and LS members using these bots. Did a new one come out or something? Not sure why I suddenly see more and more people using them.

Why wouldn't they? Considering the ridiculous lack of action taken by Square-Enix, these players are just milking it while it's safe. I've been reporting the same botter on my server daily for a week now, I don't even care if you're botting but if you do obvious shit like FATE/Gathering with the auto-afk still on, or FATE/Gathering with teleport hack; then you deserve to get banned. The thing is SE does absolutely nothing about bots. I mean seriously, they already have a hard time catching the armies of black mages running Wanderer's Palace.

Do you know how it works?. 4 bots (usually 4 BLMs, sometimes 3 and a BRD) tag for duty. Group enters Wanderer's Palace or whatever duty they're set to do. Group teleports to first pack of mobs, pull.

Group teleports out of reach of the mobs (outside of the maps, or just flying over) and nuke them down, mobs can't kill them 0 damage taken by the bots: that's why they have 4 DPS and no healer. Group teleports to the next pack/boss/whatever and repeat these steps.

Exit the dungeon, tag again These groups are generating millions daily, say hello to the inflation since there's no gil sink. How hard would it be for SE to put some checks in these dungeons? Not very hard. Are they doing it?

I think you know the answer already. SE is terrible and absolutely clueless on how to catch bots, that's why more and more players are paying for bots because they're not taking any risk at all. How hard would it be for SE to put some checks in these dungeons? Not very hard.

Care to make some suggestions? If it's that easy, you should be able to.

Ffxiv Patch 4.3

Fact is, they can't just add in checks that catch bots without it interfering with legitimate players who are just trying to play the game. Every thing you add in that is designed to catch bots has to affect normal players too. Overaggressive chat filters?

Means that normal players will have a harder time talking to their friends. Auto-ban on X number of reports?

Makes it possible for troll players to simply group on one legitimate player and report them straight into a ban. Checks on positioning? Sounds like that could add to how long it takes for your data to be processed on the servers. As for: The thing is SE does absolutely nothing about bots. Let's look at some numbers. Over the last 8 weeks, 46252 accounts have been banned in some form (temporary or permanent). That's enough players to create a highly populated server.

Total temporary bans: 373 Total permanent bans: 45879 On average, over the last 8 weeks, there have been 5781 accounts banned in some form per week. The most number of bans were done during the week starting 2 April: 10867 Followed by the week after: 10600 That's most of those 46k bans that were done over 2 weeks. Tl;dr Just because you don't see the bot you are reporting getting banned immediately doesn't mean that SE aren't doing anything about it as a general problem. And adding in checks to catch bots affects normal players, too. If you make too many restrictions on players, in general, you will end up losing more money from them not wanting to play a game which assumes they are cheaters.

Overaggressive chat filters? Means that normal players will have a harder time talking to their friends. Auto-ban on X number of reports? Makes it possible for troll players to simply group on one legitimate player and report them straight into a ban. I'm not even talking about the spammers, a 'right click report' that mutes/block invites from that account until it's checked out would be a good start. Checks on positioning?

Sounds like that could add to how long it takes for your data to be processed on the servers. Care to make some suggestions? If it's that easy, you should be able to. Every other MMO does that, there's one incredibly basic thing you find in EVERY MMO but not this one: If the monster can't reach the target in XIV it does nothing, at all. You can still nuke the shit out of it and that's a very basic flaw all these dungeon bots are exploiting. In every other MMO if the mob can't find a path to the target, the mob goes immune/reset. That would fix the current insane dungeon botting.

We have a lot of bots doing this for one reason: it's incredibly easy AND very low risk, somehow. I'm not saying this would suddenly fix all the botting issues, there's still all the gathering bots and guess what? WoW does that pretty well. If you gather the same things for a while, running/flying over the exact same point over and over, you get flagged/checked/auto temp banned. And no, real players don't do that. The thing is SE does absolutely nothing about bots.

Bots lead to money banks. Banning money banks leads to actual negative impacts. Monitoring the same bots leads to the next money banks. Money banks are the center of anti-RMT operations and for a good reason.

It may not be as effective for single rogue individuals working alone nor is it so flashy that people like you can see the actions being taken in-game (you never actually see money banks). It sure as hell is effective for fighting against the larger organizations conducting RMT business. If RMT were to roam freely there would be a massive hyperinflation. This always happens in games with a major RMT problem (in SE's case it happened in FFXI). Since this doesn't happen now it means SE is in control of the problem and that banks are indeed getting banned.

SE is in control because they don't waste their efforts banning bots when the real difference comes through banning the banks. The RMT cannot be squashed completely but it can be kept in control. SE is keeping the RMT in control. The number of bots has nothing to do with it. Firstly the way to combat it's negative effects on the economy is to scale gil drops from dungeons to the supply being demonstrated from the player base as a whole, bot or not, and I believe they do this to some degree.

Secondly if you understood economics you would know that inflation in itself is not a bad thing, and steady inflation is actually part of a healthy economy. People are encouraged to spend under inflation, it creates demand and keeps the economy moving.

There is no incentive to invest without inflation. The worry isn't if it causes inflation, but how much and is SE controlling it by adjusting the mechanics bots use to generate gil. A good example is the economy in the months following when housing hit.

People hardly spent money due to the gigantic sink of housing that everyone wanted to save for and gil generation was not as good as it is now, prices of everything dropped sharply and economic activity was dead. They'd be losing customers if they perma banned for the first offense since the average player who dabbles in botting does it for convenience on optional content that is otherwise tedious (usually the Relic for people who had a late start). These are the players that otherwise play the game and pay subscription money, and getting perma banned would mean they would quit the game instead of starting over again. Personally, I don't get the point of botting spiritbonding since the chances of being caught lately have been much higher given the aggressive number of bans the past month. Knowing who to buy gil off of would be a much easier and safer (but more expensive) alternative.

So, I noticed my enchanter getting undercut a lot. As an experiment, I posted 30 scrolls then ran an immediate cancel cycle to find out how many of them had been undercut. Twenty of them had! In less than a minute! The guy who undercut me didn't have anything listed at a higher price, which means he cancelled. I did it a few more times, and found most of my stuff getting undercut before I even finished posting the batch.

I don't want to sit at the auction house all day to have any chance of selling stuff. Besides, he shouldn't have been able to so it so quickly. Just collecting stuff from the mailbox takes more time than that. How are people doing this?

Is there some way the remote auction house can detect and cancel my undercuts and pick up the items and repost them really quickly? Is there a bot involved?

This has been going on all day. I dread to think what the glyph market is like on this server if that sort of thing is going on with enchant scrolls. When i was doing it, i would stock 20 of everything i sell, and just basicaly spam the post button, once i was down to 5 or so id cancel and loot mail. To me, nothing you have said would lead me to think hes a bot any more than a dedicated AHer.

This guy only had one auction of each scroll up, so he was somehow cancelling and re-posting.and doing it faster than I could simply post. Also, I expect you were doing that with glyphs and maybe gems.

Not with some of the pricier enchant scrolls, considering how poorly they hold their value. When I first started playing the ah I was just in the gem/enchant market. I had 25 or so different gem cuts and 6 or so sellable enchanting patterns. I'd have maybe 20 of each and I'd post 2 of each item by hand. I was doing pretty well with it until I ran into the type of player that you are describing. Everything I posted would be undercut within 20 seconds and I couldn't sell a thing.

Wow Patch 4.3

I thought it was a bot at first too, but then I asked the forums for help, and they told me to fight fire with fire and get Trade Skill Manager. Then I saw what he was doing. Listing 60 or so auctions by hand took me a good 5 minutes. Now with TSM I can just click a button 60 times and post those same auctions in 15 seconds. You cannot compete with someone like this unless you have the same tools, or maybe sell your stuff so low that he will buy everything up. One EASY solution to undercutting: Limit the weekly amount of gold you can earn from the AH (per account) and after you've met that limit, you cant sell anything on the AH.

That will give everyone a chance to use the AH. How's the limit determined? That can be done in many ways. Whats the average gold someone needs? 5K gold per week for example, or another reasonable number. If there's no one else selling that item, you can sell it, but if you've crossed the limit and someone else posts, then your AH gets cancelled.

Stuff like that. ANYTHING is better than the current situation.

This will take care of the asian bots too and anyone else who runs bots. But its not going to happen. Wow admins don't care. One EASY solution to undercutting: Limit the weekly amount of gold you can earn from the AH (per account) and after you've met that limit, you cant sell anything on the AH. That will give everyone a chance to use the AH.

How's the limit determined? That can be done in many ways.

Whats the average gold someone needs? 5K gold per week for example, or another reasonable number. If there's no one else selling that item, you can sell it, but if you've crossed the limit and someone else posts, then your AH gets cancelled. Stuff like that. ANYTHING is better than the current situation. This will take care of the asian bots too and anyone else who runs bots.

But its not going to happen. Wow admins don't care.

The problem with that is what would happen to trade chat. We'd all be wading through massive amounts of spam if that happened. 12:27 PMPosted by One EASY solution to undercutting: Limit the weekly amount of gold you can earn from the AH (per account) and after you've met that limit, you cant sell anything on the AH. That will give everyone a chance to use the AH.

While you're at it, limit the number of ore nodes people can mine per week, and herb nodes, and the number of mobs they can skin, the number they can kill, and the number of dungeons they can run. In fact, why not just mail every player some gold each week? /sarcasm Limiting the AH only hurts players who like using the AH. If someone really wanted to use the AH, they would sell at whatever the market price of that item is, regardless of competition. The AH is a player run market.

If one person wants to, and has the funds to, they can control the entire AH. If you don't like it, undercut them or find a new game. Limiting the AH only hurts players who like using the AH. If someone really wanted to use the AH, they would sell at whatever the market price of that item is, regardless of competition. Rubyheart, while I agree with you for the most part, the limit can potentially hurt the casual buyers more, at least on smaller servers.

If you limit the amount of gold made, then fewer goods will be put up in general. Say there are three people in the pvp plate market. The first two make their quota of gold by Thursday, so by Friday, the third person jacks the price up since he knows he's the only one selling right now. A buyer comes by, doesn't want to pay that price, so he tries to find ore so he can get a guildy to make it. Most of the farmers have made their quota also, so now a stack of ore is going for 1000g.

This is the problem with many of the limits people want to put on the AH. There will always be cascading effects that will make it worse for the buyer, not better.

Edit: Forgot that the original suggestion was made for the non-camping sellers. While those people might get the couple of extra sales, it is not worth destroying the AH for everyone else. There are other ways around the campers. The problem with that is what would happen to trade chat. We'd all be wading through massive amounts of spam if that happened.

(1) Trade chat is called Trade chat for a reason. If you're looking for general 'chat' use the other channel.

If we need a new channel, then thats also a solution. (2) The solution to that too is simple. Limit the amount of messages you can send. There's already a limit. Can trade chat be filled with messages related to trade? Ofcourse it can, its called TRADE chat.

You cant call it spam. If one person wants to, and has the funds to, they can control the entire AH. If you don't like it, undercut them or find a new game. Great that you think that's fair.

The first two make their quota of gold by Thursday, so by Friday, the third person jacks the price up since he knows he's the only one selling right now. A buyer comes by, doesn't want to pay that price, so he tries to find ore so he can get a guildy to make it. Most of the farmers have made their quota also, so now a stack of ore is going for 1000g. Things like that would only happen if there were really only 3 people selling stuff. There are many people who sell stuff, all the time. If somoene sees a 1000g ore stack, what is he going to do?

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He's going to go out mining and post some ore of his own, lower than 1000g. You forgot that part and you forgot to extend the example. Don't understand the full effect they would have.

Right, I think you're the one who doesnt understand the full effect of your own example. And remember two things: (1) The current situation is abuse and unfair. It doesn't give everyone a fair chance of having their goods sold.

The situation is NOT acceptable. (2) There are solutions to problems and they may not be perfect, but they'll be better than the situation in #1. They can be improved. There are MULTIPLE other solutions: - Don't allow any auction to be cancelled for atleast 6 hours. OR: - Limit the number of cancellations that can be done on an hourly / 3 hourly basis. People can be a republican and say 'no' to each solution but remember point #1.

The aim is to stop these 3 minute undercutters, or atleast limit their activity, so everyone has a better chance of selling stuff. Thats the aim. Anyone who thinks our points suck do so because they're an undercutter themselves. They don't want to be stopped so they'll stay stuff like 'quit whining, undercut yourself, its a free market, etc'. Meanwhile I'm checking for undercuts using Auctionator. I've started doing it today.

I was posting stuff by hand before. I want to do it like these guys do. I know the only variable that I need is, how frequently I check for undercuts and currents its about 60 seconds when I'm on the computer. I'm doing OK, I'm seeing anyone else who does it as frequently as I do. Right now this is the only way to deal with this.

Do I feel bad for the 20 other people who listed something yesterday and its all buried now because they arent undercutting every 3 minutes? Yes, but I have no option. I have to deal with these undercutters who wont let me sell anything. If one person wants to, and has the funds to, they can control the entire AH.

If you don't like it, undercut them or find a new game. Great that you think that's fair. What exactly do you think isnt fair about it?

If you had said it isnt right, ok i could see that angle. But you have the same ability to buy that guy that controls the market if you chose to. Things like that would only happen if there were really only 3 people selling stuff. There are many people who sell stuff, all the time.

If somoene sees a 1000g ore stack, what is he going to do? He's going to go out mining and post some ore of his own, lower than 1000g. You forgot that part and you forgot to extend the example. While its true there likely will be more than 3 people, it still doesn't change that as the week goes on and more people cap, the prices will go up. (1) The current situation is abuse and unfair.

It doesn't give everyone a fair chance of having their goods sold. The situation is NOT acceptable. (2) There are solutions to problems and they may not be perfect, but they'll be better than the situation in #1. They can be improved. 1 highly subjective.

There are MULTIPLE other solutions: - Don't allow any auction to be cancelled for atleast 6 hours. OR: - Limit the number of cancellations that can be done on an hourly / 3 hourly basis. Both hurt you as much, if not WAY more than the tycoons you are trying to stop. They can afford to and would just stock more of items. 09:08 AMPosted by (1) The current situation is abuse and unfair. It doesn't give everyone a fair chance of having their goods sold. The situation is NOT acceptable.

You seem to be misunderstanding something very important. It's not supposed to be fair. If someone is willing to put more effort into watching the AH, and adjusting his auctions accordingly, why should someone who puts in no effort whatsoever be allowed to make the same amount of gold? The auction house is the easiest thing to translate real world properties to. If one person puts more work into it, they get a bigger pay off. If someone doesn't put a lot of work into it, they don't get a large pay off.

Saying that the person who's willing to put more work in should make the same amount of money as someone not putting in any work is. What did you call it? The auction house is the easiest thing to translate real world properties to.

If one person puts more work into it, they get a bigger pay off. If someone doesn't put a lot of work into it, they don't get a large pay off. Saying that the person who's willing to put more work in should make the same amount of money as someone not putting in any work is.

What did you call it? You're being vague. The real world is not a compatible example. Here's a real world example that you can compare it to: - 20 sellers each have exactly the same item to sell. 3 of the sellers visit the store where their products are on display and every 3 minutes rearrange the items so their item is at the front. The items from the other sellers never sell.

You think that's fair, because they 'invest more time' in it? The real world therefore cannot be compared to the Wow AH in any way. There's no example you can find that matches what goes on in the Wow AH.

Here's another solution: The item that is bought is chosen randomly among items that have small differences in costs. So if there are 10 items costing about 2000g, but only a 5 copper difference among them, then the item is bought randomly, and not the one that has the lowest price. 20 sellers each have exactly the same item to sell. 3 of the sellers visit the store where their products are on display and every 3 minutes rearrange the items so their item is at the front. The items from the other sellers never sell. You think that's fair, because they 'invest more time' in it?

A big box store like walmart is not an applicable example, but a farmer's market is. The sellers all determine their own prices. They are free to lower their prices to be less than their competitors in order to sell. Who are you to say they can't?

Here's another solution: The item that is bought is chosen randomly among items that have small differences in costs. So if there are 10 items costing about 2000g, but only a 5 copper difference among them, then the item is bought randomly, and not the one that has the lowest price. Absolutely terrible idea. If I'm buying something on the AH, I go to spend Xg, not Xg +- 5c.

And there are people I won't buy from, I'll sometimes pay more to avoid buying from a specific person. How does that work into your little 'fix'?

Likewise, if I'm selling things for a similar price than someone, I want them to buy mine, not have mine skipped over because of a random system.